Welcome to the Small Business Big mindset podcast, where we dive into tactical strategies to grow your business and make an impact on this world. A huge part of success is keeping your mindset and vision on track. So this is a major part of our process. And this podcast. Let's do this Hey, everybody, welcome to the Small Business Big mindset podcast. I am so super excited to welcome my friend Laura Scholes onto the podcast. She is founder of the 24 hour site and founder of her own copywriting agency story house creative welcome, Laura.

Thank you, Erin. It is a thrill to be here.

I was like Laura and I go back a bit. And we haven't seen each other via zoom and quite a while I think earlier in 2022, you actually got to see each other in person. So I'm just overjoyed to just even get to see you virtually. Yes. So let's just dive in. Let's Can you tell us a little bit about yourself, your background and how you got started?

Yeah, sure. So I started my career with words, as a journalist, I was a journalism major, worked as a journalist, nothing high stakes, I did a lot of editing, I edit a magazine for lighting design when I lived in New York, and then I edited a magazine for medical students. And it was great. And then I moved out. And then I went and got my MFA, which is a Master of Fine Arts in fiction at University of Montana, which was also great, wrote a book, nothing happened. And then when I moved to San Francisco, journalism was 20,000, for journalism was kind of bottoming out, my expenses were up. And so I decided to start copywriting and I just fell in love with it. So I was bringing all of my storytelling skills that I developed as a journalist into business writing, writing for businesses, websites, and just loved it and built that built that agency, keeping it very small, doing all my own stuff, and, and then started the 24 hour site, which is really just to satisfy an itch of my own. And some things I was seeing for my smaller clients, to help them get great websites, beautiful Squarespace websites without just having pulling their hair out over working with a developer and hiring a copywriter and doing all the things it was a one stop shop. And I've been doing that for a few years now. And I absolutely love it.

That's awesome. I know, when you were telling me about the 24 hours, I was like, That's genius, because it's like, you know, there are a lot of these DIY kind of platforms out there. But to get the look, the polished, unique look that each business owner really wants, I think it does take some extra help or some extra expertise in order to make those, those tweaks and those fundamental changes. So you know, I know personally, you know, I'll look at the, the, the templates that they have, and they're great. But then I look at someone else's, you know, website, and I'm like, Ah, but there's looks, you know, they just have this extra, you know, value and so

totally, I think the thing that I found with my clients, and again, the reason I they were copywriting clients, so they, they had kind of an idea of what they wanted to say on their website, and that helped them with stuff. But then they would be working with the developer in wherever overseas who was just kind of throwing copy into a really basic template and, and it just hurt my soul to see copy that we've crafted. So carefully just put kind of willy nilly No, in a website not making any sense. So like I said, it's a little bit selfish on my part. But then it's turned into something really great too. And what I realized too, is most my core, the people that I'm going after, in my business are solopreneurs people maybe who had been working in the corporate world and have gone out on their own either by choice or by necessity, and on the professional side of things. So they don't need a site with a million razzle dazzle elements. They just need something that looks beautiful and clean and probably looks a lot better than the sites that their competitors have. And I just knew that that didn't take a million dollars or months and months. We could do it pretty quickly and get them something really great. And then Bill But from there of course if needed, but just to get their site live quickly was just such a relief for people who were, who are really knew that they couldn't really run their business until they had a website to direct people to.

Yeah, no, it's so super value valuable and you launched 24 hour site you launch that out. Have you started story house creative? First correct and then

started? Yeah, I started story house creative. Right in the housing meltdown, great recession 2007 2008 wasn't the best time to start a business. So those first those that first year was a little was tough. You know, I had a two year old at the time, I think our kids are the same age. So you might remember those dark days

in the trenches

with a kid in preschool that is just shockingly expensive here in the Bay Area anyway, but stuck it out. And it was great. And it turned into something great. And then about three years ago, when I felt like I had my copywriting agency, it was kind of just repeat business, I have several design firms I work with, and I'm the copywriter of record kind of for their clients. So I don't have to hustle a lot with that business right now. But I missed a little bit of the hustle. So I said, oh, I'll just start another business and get that hustle by back. And, and it has continued to be a hustle. A fun one. But um, you know, every business is, is it should be a little bit of one, I think to make it exciting.

Yeah, no, I totally agreed. And this is great. I want to kind of double down on this. Because I think so many entrepreneurs solopreneurs. They, they go out and they they start this one business. And then sometimes they're like, Well, I started this business, that's all that I can do, you know? And it's just like, No, no, you don't have to just do the one. Or they do have ideas like of like, oh, I would really love you know, to do this kind of a business, whether or not it's related to what they originally did. But they don't know how, you know, like, what are the steps that they take? So can you break that down for us a little bit? Like how, what were the first steps? Like how did you kind of get started in launching this this other business?

Yeah, I mean, that's a really good question. And I'm, I'm kind of combing my memory bank, it. Erin, I really just made it up. It wasn't strategic. I just said, Oh, it was like one of those lightbulb moments like, oh, I want to do this. And I'm in green. I didn't just slap it up. But it was close to slapping it up. And I've obviously evolved the evolved it over time. But the important thing for me because I tend to unless I take action, I'll tend to think about and analyze stuff forever. So I thought if I could just get a couple, just decide on what I'm doing. Get a couple of guinea pig clients. And just see if it works. I mean, that was the other big thing. Does this even work? In the first few websites? I did it because we do we start at 9am West Coast time. And then by six or 7pm, the site is live and launched. The first one I did, I literally started at 9am that day and was at 11:59pm that night. I mean, it took a long time, I've learned you know, I kind of start earlier and get some some homework done beforehand. So I've learned a lot. But my point is like, you don't know what's going to work until you do something. And so I'm all for planning and strategizing and getting all of your ducks in a row. When you're starting a new business. I think sometimes you just have to put it out there, see what the responses, give it a try and then iterate and evolve until it becomes something that really feels solid. I think too, it helped a lot that my business is adjacent to my core, what was my core business and still kind of is my core copywriting business. I'm using the same skills, lots of different skills, but there's kind of a core foundation that I feel really confident in and solid about. And it's a key differentiator for for my new business too. So I think that's important not to say you can't start you know, if you're a web designer and you want to start a dog grooming business, not saying you can't do that. It totally works. But I think it helped ease my path because the two businesses were pretty related. Or synergistic anyway.

Yeah. So how did you Start out getting clients for this this new business, too.

Yeah, I mean, that has been the trickiest part, I guess it's kind of the trickiest part of any business. But because I'm this is such a, it's it's really individual. So it's not companies. So it's like, I do a website for one person. And then I need another person, typically. And I do everything from psychologists, websites to life coaches, to accountants, doctors. It's a very broad customer base. And so I've had trouble figuring out how to niche my marketing. But at the beginning, which was your question is, it was word of mouth, and a lot of it is still word of mouth. And I think a lot of businesses operate that way. You know, I did a few, like I said, guinea pig clients, than they recommended me. And then those people recommended me. And now it's a lot of word of mouth. And I'm getting some work through posting on LinkedIn. Instagram, not so much. I mean, everybody has to be there. But my customer is more on LinkedIn than Instagram. Right now. Anyway, so I've really been trying to make sure I use that platform for for marketing and just getting myself out

there. Yeah, I found LinkedIn to be a very valuable resource, more so than the other social platforms to especially as it's grown to be more of a networking, conversational social piece, rather than just kind of slapping your resume up there trying to find a job as it was when it first launched. Right.

Oh, Billy, I mean, I think the other thing that's important to note about LinkedIn is that, you know, Instagram is a different vibe, right? Like, you're kind of it's kind of looser and more fun. And you kind of write, if you're writing posts or kind of marketing yourself, it's a little bit different voice, I find that bringing that more business casual voice from Instagram back into LinkedIn with a post, like basically copying my Instagram posts, maybe making a few tweaks taking out some cursing or something. But that voice on LinkedIn really gets people's attention, whereas it's just de rigueur on Instagram. So I think that's a good tip for people is kind of lighten up be more personal on LinkedIn, then you might feel comfortable with it first. But it really does seem to catch people's attention and makes you stand out and in a way that you wouldn't if you were just being a little bit more dry and buttoned up.

Yeah, no, I agree. It's about it best to be yourself and more organic for sure. Rather than this, like, sterile robot corporate beak. thing, right? And how do you manage it? timewise right. So let's say like a lot of our, you know, listeners are entrepreneurs. Some of them they're, they're in different stages of their career. But, you know, let's say they want to embark on a second or third or, you know, initiative, how do you kind of manage multiple businesses at once?

This is the quest of my lifetime, Aaron, is to figure out how to do this. I've heard and some people do box like time box, like they only work on their side business or their other business on certain days and they work on other business other days. I, my Protestant work ethic roots will not let me do that, like I may be overly responsive to my clients. And so if I if a copywriting client says, oh, we need Oh, can you make a change on this piece that you did, and that comes in on a Tuesday, the day that I'm supposed to be working only on 24 Our site stuff, I don't ignore it, I do it. So there's a lot of bleeding into each other. That said, I think the biggest the biggest lesson I've learned is that business of building which the 20 of our site business really needs more, as I said than my copywriting, like blocking out time to build my business. You know, send emails, write posts, write emails, touch base with previous clients. booking time in my day for that is super important. And then my my theory is like, the more the 24 hour site business becomes a bigger part of my income split. It will naturally evolve that I'll say, Okay, well, I've got a full 50% coming from websites now. I need to be putting a full 50% of my time into that business. And right now I'm at about 7030, which is 70%, copywriting 30%. Websites, which some getting closer, and I think that will naturally force me to do the splitting that I need to do on my time.

Okay. Yeah, no, that makes sense. I think it is. It's like, the bane of everybody's existence is like, how do we manage our time with everything that we have going on in our lives? It's how do you market toward these two groups? Like, do you have the one email list? Where you, you know, you kind of like, talk about both businesses, since they are similarly related? Or do you prefer to keep them separate? How do you manage that?

Yeah, that's a really good question. I separate them out. Mainly, because, like I said earlier, my what my copywriting business is, is is so kind of dialed with my design firm clients that I'm not so I'm not really having to, again, quote unquote, market that businesses much the any marketing I do is really focused on 24 hour site. So yeah, I don't think I posted anything on LinkedIn from storyhouse creative and in a gajillion years. And I part of that is, is because I'm building this other business. And part of it is also I, I really think that I think people have a hard time. Buying copywriting, like, a website is like a thing, if you understand what it is you understand what you're getting. And copywriting I think can be a little harder to, to delineate like, you can't You're not selling an email or you sell a website, writing. But it's such a, it's such a bespoke sell. Not just offering as a service at X number of dollars for copywriting. It's every proposal is unique, and every client has a different need. So it's a little harder, I think, to market that rather than packages, like I have with a 24 hour site.

Yeah, like a website is more tangible. And it's like it can fit into a pretty little box. Or it's like copywriting little less a little less. Yes. More gray lines and blurred. That's for sure. So as you've done this, you've launched this new new ish, new ERP business and you're managing the two is there what have you learned, right? Like any kind of key learnings that you're like, Listen, guys, like do not do this, or, you know, this is like, I did this. And I'm like that as a lesson. Anything that you could share?

Yes, um, the biggest lesson I've learned that I will always be learning is get help when you need it, or even before you think you need it. I'm so used to doing everything myself. It's the way I've grown my business. But it's also I'm sure kept me from growing bigger. But I am a control freak. And I like doing everything. I mean, you probably feel this way with writing, too with copywriting too. Like, if it's not you, your voice you're like, I just it doesn't feel right to like, farm things out to other writers like I just I get really freaked out about that. But what I'm not freaked out about is learning what tools my businesses need to grow and then hiring people to do those things. Like I recently got on dubsado for the 24 hour site business. It's it's a great CRM tool that you can get but similar to like somebody who didn't know how to make a website saying, Oh, great, I'll just get Squarespace and make my own website dubsado Oh, great. I'll get dubsado And I'll have this instantly amazing CRM tool. But no, it takes a lot to set up. And I could have figured it out. And I was kind of interested in figuring it out because I kind of get nerdy on that kind of thing. But I quickly realized this is beyond this is not what I think need to be spending my time and money on much better to pay someone it'll take them a lot less time than it will pay the night would take me at my hourly rate I would be it would cost me a lot of money. So that has that has been a force, a force thing because of having to businesses I just can't do everything by myself anymore. And getting over that I think Like, especially if you own your own business, it can be really hard to welcome other voices into your business. Other expertise is expertise I. And, and, and you know, let people help you out. I mean, I also have, this is maybe a little woowoo. But like, I do also have this thing of where if you're, if you're making money, I do think it's good to hire people and like get that money out into the world, like, rather than hoarding it and like figuring dubsado out on myself and not seeing my family at dinner, because I'm heads down. Let somebody else hire somebody else and make their life better by paying them. And then like, it's just kind of this ecosystem of good things that I think happen because of that, too. And granted, you have to get to a place in your business where you can afford that. And I may be speaking of privilege, but I think there's something to be said to about like, make a little investment, get that money out there and watch it come back to you. Because you got a professional to do something that you didn't know how to do. Yeah,

no, I agree with that. Because then it gives you more time for you to lend your time to your area of expertise. And then you can farm out the others. And I do love the mindset of like, you know, you're allowing other people to sharpen their skills and strengthen their trade, you know, by kind of farming it out to them. Yeah. And what do you suggest for people when they're coming to work with you? What, what are your tips of like, what should they already know? Or what should they be prepared to discuss? They're like, Laura, I need a website. You know, like, what, what are kind of the first few things you kind of walk them through?

Yes, yes. I love this question. Because it is, it isn't a problem I anticipated. And but it's so important that I did put on my website, like, when you're ready to do a site? Yeah. When I first asked him was like, What are you selling? Like? Like, literally, like, sometimes people need don't realize how much they don't know about their own business yet. Like, they haven't gotten their packages figured out, or I'm not really sure I kind of want to do this. And I kind of want to do that. And like you're not ready for a website. I mean, I can help you. But I'm not a business consultant or a strategist. But when you're ready to do your website, it's when you're you have, here's, here's what I'm offering, here's how much it costs. Here's what's included in these different offerings. And you know, maybe it's not an offering based business, but you, you need to come in knowing who you are, what you've got to offer, what makes it unique. I do a brand questionnaire that helps people figure kind of the nuances of that out. But you've got to have your business kind of dialed i can't make a business for you. I can just bring the business that you created and make it beautiful and and make people want it on a website.

Yeah, no, that's a really smart because I think so many people rush, they're like, oh, I have a business idea. Let's do it. You know, it's they don't they skip over the non maybe not as fun parts, you know, where it's like, Who is this business for? Why should they care? Like, what problem? Am I solving? Like, you know? Or if it's not even a problem, like how am I making people feel better? Or you know, or what, whatever it may be, I think a lot of people skip to like, I need a logo and a website, you're like, Well, what, what do you do?

Yeah, yeah, exactly. And it's mean, I think that is one of the differences in my businesses because I come from copywriting background. And I mean, I'm gonna say brand strategy. But as you know, you're a copywriter, you know, that you can't execute successfully on a copy project until, you know, the value proposition and who they're talking to like. So I've had to become kind of a semi expert in that kind of strategy type stuff. And so I do bring that lens to website building, because it just, it doesn't do anybody any good. It's a waste of money. Actually, if you go into hiring somebody to build a website, and you haven't thought about these things, you're going to have kind of a dead site that is not not making anybody do anything. Pick up the phone, send you an email, it's going to be kind of dead. So super important for my business and for the people

that I work with, ya know, for sure. And how do you stay sane, like you have all these different businesses you have? You know, your MMA, like how do you what do you do? Is there anything? Some people have daily routine, some people just, you know, every quarter they do something like people meditate workout, like, is there something that you kind of do that kind of keeps you even keeled.

Oh, Aaron, if you only knew the list of things that I do, I, I part of it is to keep me sane. Yes. And part of it is just because I'm, again kind of a nerd I listened to Andrew Huberman podcast Peter, a TIA Podcast. I'm super into kind of biohacking. That's probably going too far. I'm not I'm not one of these dudes doing a lot of biohacking stuff. But like, yeah, I meditate. Every morning, I do breathing exercises most days, I always get out and run or do something outside in the morning to kind of get my body going. I'm definitely a morning person. So that helps a lot. So I get up at like 530 and get a bunch done before I have to wake my ever later sleeping teenager to go to school. And that's key it without that time. I because I tend to just as soon as I wake up open My Computer, what happened overnight, what do I need to in it's, and it's ridic. It just stresses me out all day long if I start that way. So I've developed these tools. And one thing that I is my goal for this year, not not a goal, but like a practice that I'm implementing this year is because of the pandemic. I've always mostly always worked at home anyway. But I used to go to coffee shops a lot more to work and kind of get out in the world. And then the pandemic kind of shut that down. And I'm, I just realized over the holiday break that I need to get out in the world more again, even if it's only at a coffee shop, or I live in Oakland, California, like take the train into the city and work at a coffee shop there just have a different view. I just have had this tunnel vision for the past couple of years. And you know, I'm a creative that's not I don't think great for creative. So my one of my practices this year is, is get out more, get away from my computer more. And kind of look around at the world a little bit. I think it's gonna be good for me.

No, that is huge. And quick shout out to Oakland. I lived there for a number of years. Love, love love Oakland, it's I think it's my favorite city in the Bay Area. Yeah, totally biased, because I live there. Yeah, and so and I've thought about doing the same. It's like there's so many cool coffee shops like I'm in. I'm currently in Austin. So between Austin, Oakland, different areas of the country. I mean, there's so many cool spots, and then it's also to your point earlier, then you're supporting local businesses and kind of getting that out there, too. So I also work from home and it can be pretty isolating. I do enjoy it. But it's good to kind of like get yourself out into the world. And then that'll spark your creativity as you're saying to you could shake up a conversation with someone or overhear a conversation. You know, I hear you too. So what as you look forward, what goals and like vision do you have for your your businesses, launching a third one maybe.

Like just, I just launched a new service last week. So now there are three ways to work with me at the 20 of our site, you can get a full website that was my original service, you can get a spruce up. So that's me going in and getting one page of your site really dialed or something in between which is like you need more help than on one page. But you don't need a whole new site. So take about a half a day and go in and kind of change out crappy stock photography or give you some great new headlines, maybe move some things around. So the information architecture is working on the pages that there's a ton I can do and in a few hours so so those are the three services I'm going to be promoting and selling this year which is exciting. And in my vision, I mean, my vision for how I live in the world is to stop to split my my income as I said 50 And that means for copywriting really pulling back which will be hard but pulling back doing bigger clients longer term projects not being involved in kind of daily or weekly deadlines which I have some now. So kind of really stepping that back and then having more control over my 24 hour site work so that as I get older, I am older as I get even older. I'll just have a little bit more control over My time and not as as beholden to, you know, daily client work. That's my ultimate goal. So that looks like, you know, a couple of days a week doing copy, and then one or two, one day a week doing a website, and then having a little bit more free time. So, yeah, maybe start another business or just keep my head up looking out, like we said earlier, getting getting more creative time. Yeah, so

kind of increasing the power you have over your day and how your time is spent. Sounds like so that's sounds beautiful to me. Where, where can people find you online? And where? How can they work with you?

Yeah, yeah. So 24 hour site is the 24 hour site.com. Um, and then my copywriting agency is story house creative.com. I don't know why I picked two of the longest URLs and email addresses. But I think that's how it works these days. Everything's gone. But yeah, it's, it's a lot to write on a form. They never my emails never fit. When I'm filling out my email on a form. It always goes down the side. Yeah, so the 24 hour site.com and storyhouse creative.com.

Perfect. We'll include links to those in the show notes. And we always wrap up by asking this question, which is if you could only listen to one music artist for the rest of your life, who would it be?

Oh, my goodness. Um I'm gonna have to say Nick Drake. I don't know if people know him. He was an English singer songwriter. I became. I was introduced to him as probably anybody in America who's not a complete music nerd. He died a long time ago. He's from the 70s, I guess. Anyway, I was introduced to him in like 2000 When Volkswagen used his song Pink Moon on a commercial. And I remember I was living in Montana at the time at grad school. And I remember just stopping in my tracks like, what what I still get chills thinking about it. Like What song is this and that I went down a deep rabbit hole. And he's he's still one of my favorites and just has that. As I said, one of my favorite genres is music is sad boys singing. I just I just love an emo dude. Singing songs. So he's kind of the poster child for that.

I am right there with you, him Elliott Smith. I mean, there's so many there's like a long list. But I had the same experience. I remember that commercial. In fact, I have like, googled it multiple times to, to rewatch it a moment because I love it and and that is how I was introduced to him as well. And I was like, Who is this? I need to know this person immediately. And and then I also became a fan and I actually had that car. It was meant to be Yeah, it was their cabrio. And it was like their little convertible and I had

such a car so far. I've had I haven't made another plugin, though. In a similar vein, since we have an affinity for segway singing. There's a guy called Damien Rice. Do you know him? I

don't want to check it out.

I was living in New York and I went to this little outside Music Festival down at South Street Seaport. And there it was the middle of a workday. And there were only like 30 people there. And this guy got on the stage with a cello player, a woman cello player. And I again, I can still feel my reaction. I was like, Who is this? Where are we? Why are people not freaking out? It was the most amazing performance I had ever seen. And I've been to a ton of shows. And he hasn't I think he only had maybe one or two albums but look him up. But oh, the name of album is oh, just the letter. Oh, it's Damian. Right. So So if our listeners are as fond of EMO boys, go check out Damien Rice.

That's good. I'm gonna do as soon as we can here. That's an avid treat. Laura, thank you so much for taking the time to chat today. I've had so much fun.

I loved it. And it was so great to see you again.

You too. All right. Thanks, Laura. We'll talk to you soon. Thanks for tuning in to the Small Business Big mindset podcast. To keep the fun going check out our Facebook group start and scale an online business For even more free trainings and resources from fellow entrepreneurs. If you haven't already, head on over to muscle creative.com and click subscribe to join our email list for weekly updates. And if you've enjoyed this podcast episode, check us out on your favorite podcast platform to follow us and give us a review. As always be authentic bringing insane amount of value and keep crushing it